Pre-delay times for reverbs per Orchestral Instrument Family?

I would like to know if anyone in here has a link to a good PDF chart online for setting the pre-delay time depending on seating positioning for each instrument family in the orchestra? :slight_smile:

1 Like

I can’t remember where I read it but the recommendation was

Front - Long(ish) predelay - these you will get early reflections first
Mid- Medium predelay - then these
Back -No predelay

I’ve tried it and it seems to work as long as you stick to one reverb

TDR proximity is really useful for repositioning samples if they have reverb on them already or sound in the wrong place

Do you have a preference for what reverb you use for orchestral stuff?

1 Like

I use Spaces 2 by EW. I checked out the proximity plug-in, but they say in the comments that it does not work for Catalina. Are there any commercial plug-ins like it?

It’s a super interesting but a super though topic as well @Mikael .The reason is that you most likely use different samples from different developers. So they have different rooms, acoustics, response-times, EQ, etc.

Let me explain why this topic is tough: As I said before, when you use two different sample developers, you have two different rooms in using. Strings from X and Brass from Y. When you have both at the same volume, you should hear either the strings or the brass more in front or more in the back, due to room acoustics in the recordings. In most cases you can’t make the samples super dry and apply only “your” reverb. Vienna Ensemble patches are working with this concept which works best, but other developers don’t use in most cases. You either have a big hall room, or 2-3 mic positions.

I remember during my studies that this was one of the biggest topics back then. All students and tutors were thinking about that concept how to make a chart works best etc. it’s easy to calculate that chart yourself actually. You know that sound is travelling around 340m/s, so you can calculate the position of the conductor to the distance of the sections etc. BUT there is a big BUT, true reverb works only as a true space when you use the interaural time differences (AB micing), that’s how our ears perceive sound. So when you start messing with these as well, you will quickly realise that your samples will start sounding phasy due to the haas-effect. The reason is because they were already recorded in AB.

My question now: Do you really want to apply the haas-effect on a haas-effect? I am not sure. :slight_smile:

My tip:

  1. Use your ears! “Pfff, dude, I already heard it 1000s times!”…I know, but your ears are everything!
  2. Set the levels right. First the same loudness for both groups and then adjust to your liking by pushing forward or backward the faders and volume.
  3. Use EQ for positioning furthermore. Low/Highs…
  4. Use different types of reverbs. The group which is in the front uses only early-reflection or nothing at all, so you make it as dry as possible. The other groups you adjust by early-reflections and the right reverb tail. Again, use your ears. Use EQ on reverb-return as well. Can work wonders!
  5. You can adjust the panorama as you like for more realism if you want to.
  6. Use one reverb for the whole orchestra which blends everything together. But don’t overdo here, as you can mess up your early-reflections, which you set before in the other groups can be blurred to not be heard anymore.

Hope that makes sense again :slight_smile:

PS: Proximity had something weird, which I need to check out again. I’ll let you know. I think they have messed with phase as well…I’ll get back to you later @pj1240


Mathewlane Drms looks interesting if a bit expensive. Haven’t tried it yet but gets good reviews and you seem to be able to do quite a lot with it.

1 Like